Wednesday, July 9, 2003

Last modified at 11:55 p.m. on Tuesday, July 8, 2003


"Old life, name gone now", says 1967 prison escapee


By Silla Brush
Times-Union staff writer

Joel Lee Saye says his life under that name is long over.

In his place for the last 35 years has been Allen Lawrence, the life
he has led since escaping from a North Carolina prison in November
1967. He was serving 20 years for burglary and assault with intent
to commit rape.

"That man, Mr. Saye, is dead," he said, in a telephone call from
Duval County jail yesterday.

After his escape, he moved to Jacksonville where he soon met his
future wife, Nell Lawrence. She said she and the couple's two
children didn't know anything about Saye's past until last week.

Saye, 64, was arrested Thursday after an anonymous tip was called
into the Jacksonville Sheriff's Office about his whereabouts. He
waived extradition Monday and is now waiting for North Carolina
authorities to decide whether he should serve more time.

Saye said the conviction that led to his prison sentence is wrong.

"I didn't rape nobody," he said.





Nell Lawrence's husband Allen, whose real name was Joel Lee Saye,
escaped from a North Carolina prison in 1967, five years after being
convicted of burglary and assault.
-- Bob Mack/Staff



Saye claims he had been drinking and returned home one night to make
coffee. He said he went to a neighbor's apartment to ask for sugar
when the incident took place.

"I staggered in and fell on her," he said. "She thought I was going
to attack her. I tried to quiet the lady down. 'Please, please. Why
are you yelling?'"

He said he was later told that he cut the woman with a knife but was
too drunk to remember all the facts.

Saye said he didn't understand the gravity of the charges he faced
until a judge sentenced him to 20 years. Saye said he didn't even
know what "appeal" meant. He began serving the sentence in February
1962.

"One day I said, 'I can't take this anymore,'" he said. He escaped
from the Catawba Prison and went to Washington to get a Social
Security card and then caught a bus to Florida.

"I never told anyone that I had escaped," Saye said.

His relatives, including a brother living in Jacksonville, thought
he was on parole, he said. He told them he was going by Allen
Lawrence.

"There is not a day that goes by that I didn't think about it," he
said of his former life, but he never considered telling his wife
because he didn't know how she would react.

"It really hurt when she did find out," he said.

She discovered her husband's past as a fugitive Thursday morning
when a television reporter came to her house to ask her about the
case.

"I don't think you can be shocked any more," she said.

Lawrence said in an interview yesterday that she is standing behind
her husband.

"I've had 36 wonderful years," she said. "I wouldn't change a thing.
People say he would be out by now if he hadn't escaped, but if he
hadn't escaped I'd never have met him."

For the past 23 years, the couple has lived in a home on what used
to be Lee Road. She said the city let the couple rename the street
because there were other Lee Roads. She wanted to pick a name that
began with "J" because the first names of their children began with
that letter.

She said her husband wasn't keen when she happened to choose his
real first name, Joel.

"I had no idea that that was his name," she said.

Lawrence said her husband, who worked as a short-haul truck driver,
never really lost his temper.

"He never has been in any kind of trouble," she said. "No problems;
his employers all loved him. They said, 'One day you'll be out and
you'll have a job.'"

North Carolina Department of Corrections spokesman Keith Acree said
an official will come to take Saye back to North Carolina, where it
will be determined whether he will serve time for the escape charge.

After that, the parole commission will consider the details of the
case and determine whether Saye is a threat to society.

"It's mainly deciding how big a risk the person is," Acree said.

Saye said he is kind of glad his past came out, even if he winds up
serving more time.

"I would just like one more chance to have a few more years," he
said. "I'm not a young man."

Staff writer Silla Brush can be reached at (904) 359-4401 or via e-
mail at silla.brushjacksonville.com.